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waytooslow
05-26-2004, 01:06 PM
Got to talk to a few people last night at the BGR gathering, seems like there was two incidents of bikes dropping exhaust slip-ons on the track at Hallet, one story of almost getting hit by it flying around after it "fell" off. Scarey stuff.

might be time to add that to the list of required safety wiring??

I know that some folks think that the "wera" safety wire rules are overkill, but for me and the safety of folks on the track at the same time as myself, I have everything I can think of wired, or clipped. a ounce of safety wire is a "good" thing.

Now of course I may scare the hell out of you when you come up on my old slow butt, but assured nothing is going to fly off and hit you.

waytooslow
05-26-2004, 01:06 PM
Got to talk to a few people last night at the BGR gathering, seems like there was two incidents of bikes dropping exhaust slip-ons on the track at Hallet, one story of almost getting hit by it flying around after it "fell" off. Scarey stuff.

might be time to add that to the list of required safety wiring??

I know that some folks think that the "wera" safety wire rules are overkill, but for me and the safety of folks on the track at the same time as myself, I have everything I can think of wired, or clipped. a ounce of safety wire is a "good" thing.

Now of course I may scare the hell out of you when you come up on my old slow butt, but assured nothing is going to fly off and hit you.

TFox
05-26-2004, 04:58 PM
Yup,
There were 2 separate incidents during the big bike endurance race of exhaust canister covers falling off onto the race track. And usually followed by a couple of other bits and pieces and sound packing material (like fiberglass).

TFox
05-26-2004, 04:58 PM
Yup,
There were 2 separate incidents during the big bike endurance race of exhaust canister covers falling off onto the race track. And usually followed by a couple of other bits and pieces and sound packing material (like fiberglass).

Steve Breen
05-26-2004, 07:32 PM
Man, I almost forgot about that -- nearly tagged that thing coming up outta the *****! /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif

Steve Breen
05-26-2004, 07:32 PM
Man, I almost forgot about that -- nearly tagged that thing coming up outta the *****! /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif

Steve McNamara
05-27-2004, 11:21 AM
Good points Scott.
I had to avoid one myself!!!!
I'll bring it up at our next meeting.

Steve McNamara
05-27-2004, 11:21 AM
Good points Scott.
I had to avoid one myself!!!!
I'll bring it up at our next meeting.

06-09-2004, 04:16 PM
I think both of thos cans came apart at the rivets. Don't think that safety wire would have hepled either of those situations. However, I'll bet at least one of those cans was carbon fiber. I've peronsally had CF cans come apart on me street riding, so if we wanted to change a rule, I think that rgulating the use of CF would be the way to go.

06-09-2004, 04:16 PM
I think both of thos cans came apart at the rivets. Don't think that safety wire would have hepled either of those situations. However, I'll bet at least one of those cans was carbon fiber. I've peronsally had CF cans come apart on me street riding, so if we wanted to change a rule, I think that rgulating the use of CF would be the way to go.

waytooslow
06-09-2004, 05:21 PM
personally I hate rivets on cans... running one on my f2, and always thinking it will self destruct..

as far as CF, the micron CF I had on my VFR the CF was just a sleeve, with metal under. So if the BoD wants to ban CF cans.....

I say NO rivets, doesn't take much work to drill them out and replace with something more reliable.

will be modifying my two bros soon.

waytooslow
06-09-2004, 05:21 PM
personally I hate rivets on cans... running one on my f2, and always thinking it will self destruct..

as far as CF, the micron CF I had on my VFR the CF was just a sleeve, with metal under. So if the BoD wants to ban CF cans.....

I say NO rivets, doesn't take much work to drill them out and replace with something more reliable.

will be modifying my two bros soon.

Tom Anderson
06-09-2004, 07:04 PM
Replace the rivets with what? Nuts and bolts?
Just curious, I run a CF can, and I know one of the bikes that lost a can. The one I know of was a stainless (or aluminum) M4.
I don't want to have to go buy another can just because CF *may* come apart in some instances- exhausts are expensive items!
So, in order to prevent any of this from happening, I am willing to take safety measures to my CF M4- but with what?

Tom Anderson
06-09-2004, 07:04 PM
Replace the rivets with what? Nuts and bolts?
Just curious, I run a CF can, and I know one of the bikes that lost a can. The one I know of was a stainless (or aluminum) M4.
I don't want to have to go buy another can just because CF *may* come apart in some instances- exhausts are expensive items!
So, in order to prevent any of this from happening, I am willing to take safety measures to my CF M4- but with what?

Jason Keene
06-09-2004, 07:32 PM
okay... IMHO... drilling rivets and putting screws or whatever is bad. I think alot of this could be detected by giving the machinery a detailed inspection and opting to repair it versus kicking the can straight on the way to tech. I've seen it happen. We could add safety wire to the bolts or springs that retain the can, but changing the way the manufacturer has secured that can could possibly create a bigger problem.

Jason Keene
06-09-2004, 07:32 PM
okay... IMHO... drilling rivets and putting screws or whatever is bad. I think alot of this could be detected by giving the machinery a detailed inspection and opting to repair it versus kicking the can straight on the way to tech. I've seen it happen. We could add safety wire to the bolts or springs that retain the can, but changing the way the manufacturer has secured that can could possibly create a bigger problem.

Michael Hamric
06-09-2004, 09:34 PM
One can was carbon the other was stainless. The carbon can broke at the front rivets 2 hours after a crash. I don't know the cause of the other failure but I do know the racers and they are meticulous about the safety of their machinery. Sometimes bad things just happen. Nobody was hurt and I haven't noticed anybody that actually races voicing any grievances. However, we could mandate seat belts to ensure that the rider and bike do not separate to create two obstacles on or near the racing surface. Or, maybe not!

MH

Michael Hamric
06-09-2004, 09:34 PM
One can was carbon the other was stainless. The carbon can broke at the front rivets 2 hours after a crash. I don't know the cause of the other failure but I do know the racers and they are meticulous about the safety of their machinery. Sometimes bad things just happen. Nobody was hurt and I haven't noticed anybody that actually races voicing any grievances. However, we could mandate seat belts to ensure that the rider and bike do not separate to create two obstacles on or near the racing surface. Or, maybe not!

MH

waytooslow
06-09-2004, 09:49 PM
okay so maybe replacing the rivets is a bad idea :rolleyes: ... but I am going to look into it further, the idea of a can flipping around in front of someone, possibly hitting them is scarey stuff

waytooslow
06-09-2004, 09:49 PM
okay so maybe replacing the rivets is a bad idea :rolleyes: ... but I am going to look into it further, the idea of a can flipping around in front of someone, possibly hitting them is scarey stuff

Nate Weber
06-10-2004, 05:51 PM
Make sure to bring up the point to the board that the racers aren't properly safety wiring their turtles and snakes to their bikes either. I almost hit one and I feel I need to be sheltered by more rules and regulations :rolleyes:

Nate Weber
06-10-2004, 05:51 PM
Make sure to bring up the point to the board that the racers aren't properly safety wiring their turtles and snakes to their bikes either. I almost hit one and I feel I need to be sheltered by more rules and regulations :rolleyes:

waytooslow
06-10-2004, 05:55 PM
not sheltered... but common sense...if it can come off, wire it.. not rocket science... gezzzze :rolleyes:

waytooslow
06-10-2004, 05:55 PM
not sheltered... but common sense...if it can come off, wire it.. not rocket science... gezzzze :rolleyes:

Nate Weber
06-10-2004, 06:46 PM
Sure, whatever....
Bodywork comes of when there are wrecks, should we start safety wiring that to our bikes?

What about clipons, rearsets, brake and clutch levers? Those too?

I've seen visors come off of helmets, should we start safety wiring visors to helmets?

It's racing and it was secure before the wreck. 2 hours more of vibration caused it to fail. There comes a point when it gets ridiculous!

gezzzze is right!!!!

Nate Weber
06-10-2004, 06:46 PM
Sure, whatever....
Bodywork comes of when there are wrecks, should we start safety wiring that to our bikes?

What about clipons, rearsets, brake and clutch levers? Those too?

I've seen visors come off of helmets, should we start safety wiring visors to helmets?

It's racing and it was secure before the wreck. 2 hours more of vibration caused it to fail. There comes a point when it gets ridiculous!

gezzzze is right!!!!

waytooslow
06-10-2004, 07:31 PM
Nate..You are missing the point; please see the original post. I guess we should eliminate all safety procedures. because - hey it's "racing". And things fall off bikes, so no biggie. Safety wire will not STOP parts from coming off the bike, just another gap stop. And yes my rearsets are safety wired. I was a crew chief on UH1 (read mega vibrations) so it's all about prevention and safety.

I am now done, this has gone from a just a suggestion/question, to this. I feel that this has become counter productive. If something good comes out of it so be it, if not, that is okay as well. So have at it. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

like momma said...if you can't say something nice... don't.. well you should know.

waytooslow
06-10-2004, 07:31 PM
Nate..You are missing the point; please see the original post. I guess we should eliminate all safety procedures. because - hey it's "racing". And things fall off bikes, so no biggie. Safety wire will not STOP parts from coming off the bike, just another gap stop. And yes my rearsets are safety wired. I was a crew chief on UH1 (read mega vibrations) so it's all about prevention and safety.

I am now done, this has gone from a just a suggestion/question, to this. I feel that this has become counter productive. If something good comes out of it so be it, if not, that is okay as well. So have at it. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

like momma said...if you can't say something nice... don't.. well you should know.

CYCLE 1
06-12-2004, 12:34 AM
I have witnessed a few cans come off it really is pretty rare I would bet probably due to crashed
and just wore out. If you want safety let us mandate riv-link only chains I see clips fail
on a weekly basis at the shop and have had a few
try to decapitate me on the track.

Our tech guys do a good job and ultimately you
are responsible to have your bike in a safe
working manner.I do a walk around and check several items prior to geting on my bike and the can is on the list. :rolleyes:

CYCLE 1
06-12-2004, 12:34 AM
I have witnessed a few cans come off it really is pretty rare I would bet probably due to crashed
and just wore out. If you want safety let us mandate riv-link only chains I see clips fail
on a weekly basis at the shop and have had a few
try to decapitate me on the track.

Our tech guys do a good job and ultimately you
are responsible to have your bike in a safe
working manner.I do a walk around and check several items prior to geting on my bike and the can is on the list. :rolleyes:

Travis Pierce
06-16-2004, 08:01 PM
I think this is a good post, with safety being in mind and I can't honestly guess why anybody would be getting upset over it. If you think it may come off, secure it. The part some of you fail to realize is the amount of vibration on a bike at those rpms. Sometimes you can't even feel it, but its there, and sooner or later, if a part isn't secure the resonance will cause it to back out, come apart or fall off.
Now with a crash in mind, maybe it should have been looked at a little more closely, but the heat of the moment and wanting to get back out might have caused an oversight. Which is understandable, we are all human.

I raced with a team a couple yrs ago on an RSV and it never went down once, with no Pipe manufacturer being mentioned, the pipe failed 3 or 4 time throughout the yr due to excess vibration or lack of a quailty product. The welds failed several times at the collector, and the Can came apart more than once at the rivets.
So there is several scenarios that may cause something to fail. But complaining about safety shouldn't even be an issue. I mean come on, you could probably wire every bolt and nut on a bike and maybe add a pound. Hell, just drilling the bolts and nuts out alone your gonna lose that weight anyway. So it will balance out.

Kinda like a Super Snickers, and a Large Diet coke. hahahahaha /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

Travis Pierce
06-16-2004, 08:01 PM
I think this is a good post, with safety being in mind and I can't honestly guess why anybody would be getting upset over it. If you think it may come off, secure it. The part some of you fail to realize is the amount of vibration on a bike at those rpms. Sometimes you can't even feel it, but its there, and sooner or later, if a part isn't secure the resonance will cause it to back out, come apart or fall off.
Now with a crash in mind, maybe it should have been looked at a little more closely, but the heat of the moment and wanting to get back out might have caused an oversight. Which is understandable, we are all human.

I raced with a team a couple yrs ago on an RSV and it never went down once, with no Pipe manufacturer being mentioned, the pipe failed 3 or 4 time throughout the yr due to excess vibration or lack of a quailty product. The welds failed several times at the collector, and the Can came apart more than once at the rivets.
So there is several scenarios that may cause something to fail. But complaining about safety shouldn't even be an issue. I mean come on, you could probably wire every bolt and nut on a bike and maybe add a pound. Hell, just drilling the bolts and nuts out alone your gonna lose that weight anyway. So it will balance out.

Kinda like a Super Snickers, and a Large Diet coke. hahahahaha /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif